[Emerald Ocean]

Why do so many prominent conservatives follow the liberal multicultural mantra and beg for more immigration?

Many conservatives, especially the ubiquitous Neo-cons who have wrested control of the conservative movement, believe the more people who are let in to the country, the more opportunities they have to "convert" newcomers into conservatives.

There is no evidence to support this hypothesis, as almost all "ethnic" demographics vote lock step for Democrats and have for decades. Even high income Asians, the most economically powerful bloc of newcomers in the 21st century, strongly lean towards the Democrat party.

There is absolutely no benefit to the Republican party to allow continued legal immigration of over 1 million persons per year (90%+ of whom come from alien cultures like China, India, Pakistan, or the Philippines).

Here is yet another "conservative" pundit Sean Hannity, espousing the "fruits" of diversity and multiculturalism with South Carolina's Nikki Haley last night on Faux News:

"South Carolina Republicans accepted diversity [and their own demographic demise] by electing the first Indian female governor, etc."
[youtube]mj2odqZw7wE[/youtube]

[Daktoria]

I'm against Hispanic naturalization on the basis of due process...

...but I do see an advantage for Republicans - family values.

Hispanics are very family value oriented people, and this country is terribly lacking in that department. It's rather similar to how Irish, Italian, Polish, and Hungarian Catholics immigrated during the melting pot era.

The problem is Republicans have addicted this country to discussing economics, economics, economics.

Boring.

[Emerald Ocean]

Hispanics are very family value oriented people, and this country is terribly lacking in that department.

Family oriented.

Is that why Hispanics lead all other groups in teen pregnancy?

And drug smuggling.

And gang membership.

And as a percentage of new federal prison inmates?

[Daktoria]

Your last link doesn't work, but I'll note everything else you said. (I see you edited it.)

However, you can look here to see Hispanics are one of the most, if not the most, loyal demographic(s) to marriage, even if marriage happens after getting pregnant (as was common, and is still common, among whites who also engage in pre-marital sex):

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK19 ... 9dddd00057

This shows that parents are willing to take care of children they bring into the world.

[Emerald Ocean]

Your last link doesn't work, but I'll note everything else you said. (I see you edited it.)

However, you can look here to see Hispanics are one of the most, if not the most, loyal demographic(s) to marriage, even if marriage happens after getting pregnant (as was common, and is still common, among whites who also engage in pre-marital sex):

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK19 ... 9dddd00057

This shows that parents are willing to take care of children they bring into the world.

This is a far cry from being the all encompassing, ocean-parting ethnicity of family values.

[Daktoria]

Don't you believe family values are grounded in marriage preserving parent-child duty of care?

[Rei Murasame]

The Republican Party is essentially a party of ethnic treason, they will support these flows of mass immigration through their economic policies, because it benefits their international financier masters to do so. They will also support it coyly with their tongue pushed into their cheek, because they are working under the conceit that they can appeal to the religious sentiments of Hispanics later on in order to get votes.

They will do all that while falsely blowing racial dogwhistles about those very same Hispanics to net votes from some of the really ignorant Anglo-Saxon Republican voters who cannot connect the dots between fervently supporting global capitalism and the really obvious resulting flow of immigrants into the country, as borders are demolished by the very financial interest groups that control Republican Party ideology and policy preferences.

[Daktoria]

The Republican Party is essentially a party of ethnic treason, they will support these flows of mass immigration through their economic policies, because it benefits their international financier masters to do so. They will also support it coyly with their tongue pushed into their cheek, because they are working under the conceit that they can appeal to the religious sentiments of Hispanics later on in order to get votes.

No, that's the Democratic Party. They're the ones who endorse consumerism fueled by immigrant workaholism, and redistributing wealth to continue the cycle.

For someone who loves 1968, you should understand how Nixon took advantage of the south feeling betrayed by the Civil Rights movement's multiculturalism.

They will do all that while falsely blowing racial dogwhistles about those very same Hispanics to net votes from some of the really ignorant Anglo-Saxon Republican voters who cannot connect the dots between fervently supporting global capitalism and the really obvious resulting flow of immigrants into the country, as borders are demolished by the very financial interest groups that control Republican Party ideology and policy preferences.

What about non-Anglo-Saxons? Did you consider social values being the Republican Party's glue with the white working class?

Anglo-Saxons are predominantly middle/upper-middle class. They don't compose the majority of the electorate.

[Rei Murasame]

No, that's the Democratic Party.

They are both funded by the same interests.

For someone who loves 1968, you should understand how Nixon took advantage of the south feeling betrayed by the Civil Rights movement's multiculturalism.

Hence why I referred to their tongues in their cheeks.

What about non-Anglo-Saxons?

Fine, "European Americans" then.

[Daktoria]

They are both funded by the same interests.

http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php

If you sort by Democratic or Republican tilt, you'll see very quickly that unions support Democrats, industries support Republicans.

Hence why I referred to their tongues in their cheeks.

Fine, "European Americans" then.

Oh no you don't. I'm not letting you get off easy here.

This conflation between whites and Anglo-Saxons is actually the exact excuse taken by "liberals" in advocating affirmative action. They treat all Europeans the same, ignoring that non-Anglo-Saxons had nothing to do with slavery. If anything non-Anglo-Saxons were exploited in being attracted to immigrate for the melting pot.

THIS is why I worry about you really being a multiculturalist. You think the exact same way as them.

Furthermore, affirmative action allows Catholic working class Europeans to be exploited. This is how Nixon won the election. He forsakened northern Catholics in exchange for southern Protestants:



You asked if there's a religious center-left element in another thread.

There is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Gospel

[Rei Murasame]

If you sort by Democratic or Republican tilt, you'll see very quickly that unions support Democrats, industries support Republicans.

Yet magically finance capital owns them all.

Oh no you don't. I'm not letting you get off easy here.

Actually, the only reason I even bother to call you all Anglo-Saxons is because whenever I differentiate between European-Americans, they whine at me.

Can you tell me why that is?

Anyway, past evidence of what I would rather say:

You have invited in Hispanic immigrants that are essentially replacing your Ulster-scot, English [ie, Ango-Saxon], and German (and whatever other Europeans you have in there) population.

That's the unvarnished way to put it, since you really seem to want it. I am perfectly happy to drop the façade of calling you all as though you are English, so long as you promise not to complain about it when I do it.

Usually I get back, "we are just one culture now, Rei, and we have all interbred, that's how America is, you just don't understand white America".

And now you assert the opposite! Make up your minds, Dak!

[Daktoria]

hat's the unvarnished way to put it, since you really seem to want it. I am perfectly happy to drop the façade of calling you all as though you are English, so long as you promise not to complain about it when I do it.

Usually I get back, "we are just one culture now, Rei, and we have all interbred, that's how America is, you just don't understand white America".

I don't want to be called English though.

That's the excuse affirmative activists take in calling libertarians fascists over freedom of association.

Are you saying you want me to be a fascist?

And now you assert the opposite! Make up your minds, Dak!

Are you telling me I should lead America to the promised land?

[Rei Murasame]

Both those questions are thoroughly confusing, I have no idea how you arrived at them.

[Emerald Ocean]

The Republican Party is essentially a party of ethnic treason, they will support these flows of mass immigration through their economic policies, because it benefits their international financier masters to do so. They will also support it coyly with their tongue pushed into their cheek, because they are working under the conceit that they can appeal to the religious sentiments of Hispanics later on in order to get votes.

They will do all that while falsely blowing racial dogwhistles about those very same Hispanics to net votes from some of the really ignorant Anglo-Saxon Republican voters who cannot connect the dots between fervently supporting global capitalism and the really obvious resulting flow of immigrants into the country, as borders are demolished by the very financial interest groups that control Republican Party ideology and policy preferences.

Excellent post!


Though to believe that Mexicans are die hard Catholics would be foolish. I heard one time that Mexico has to outsource bishops and clergy from places like Poland because the latest generation is not interested in religion. Maybe that would help explain Mexico's state of chaos.

Mexico City (DF) legalized homosexual marriage and gay adoption in 2010. They even decriminalized possession of small amounts of virtually every kind of drug known to man. These don't sound like the actions of a religious people.

[Drlee]

The Republican Party is essentially a party of ethnic treason, they will support these flows of mass immigration through their economic policies, because it benefits their international financier masters to do so. They will also support it coyly with their tongue pushed into their cheek, because they are working under the conceit that they can appeal to the religious sentiments of Hispanics later on in order to get votes.

They will do all that while falsely blowing racial dogwhistles about those very same Hispanics to net votes from some of the really ignorant Anglo-Saxon Republican voters who cannot connect the dots between fervently supporting global capitalism and the really obvious resulting flow of immigrants into the country, as borders are demolished by the very financial interest groups that control Republican Party ideology and policy preferences.

True. I think maybe you should consider that the leadership of the two parties will all be long gone before hispanics tip the racial scale. I think it is wise always to look at the age of the person and the age in which they were raised to understand their behavior. People are endlessly posting that I am not a conservative because I have some views that diverge from modern republicans. I am for very strict immigration controls. That IS the conservative position. It may not be the neo-con or corporatist view but it is the traditional conservative view.

Remember. Modern republican ≠ Conservative

[Daktoria]

Excellent post!


Though to believe that Mexicans are die hard Catholics would be foolish. I heard one time that Mexico has to outsource bishops and clergy from places like Poland because the latest generation is not interested in religion. Maybe that would help explain Mexico's state of chaos.

Mexico City (DF) legalized homosexual marriage and gay adoption in 2010. They even decriminalized possession of small amounts of virtually every kind of drug known to man. These don't sound like the actions of a religious people.

Are you familiar with the Catholic Socialist revolution which happened in Mexico following WW1?

There's a reason Mexican Catholicism is corrupt.

True. I think maybe you should consider that the leadership of the two parties will all be long gone before hispanics tip the racial scale. I think it is wise always to look at the age of the person and the age in which they were raised to understand their behavior. People are endlessly posting that I am not a conservative because I have some views that diverge from modern republicans. I am for very strict immigration controls. That IS the conservative position. It may not be the neo-con or corporatist view but it is the traditional conservative view.

Remember. Modern republican ≠ Conservative

Are you a racist or a hypocrite?

I don't see how strong immigration controls and universal health care are compatible...

...unless you're a corporatist, but you said you're not.

[Jeliza-Rose]

Illegal immigration makes perfect sense if you are looking to do 3 things.

1. Drive wages down
2. Undermine labor unions
3. Excite the fascists in your party to vote out any moderates.

It's a win/win for the right-wing.
It's all about consolidating power and money into private hands.

Remember, these people see all of you as mongrels anyway; you are not one of them and you never will be.
You don't live in their world.

You know how you feel when you see aborigines living in mud huts with stick furniture?
That's how they see you living in your two bedroom apt./house, full of particle board furniture.

[Drlee]

Are you a racist or a hypocrite?

I don't see how strong immigration controls and universal health care are compatible...

...unless you're a corporatist, but you said you're not.

Ok. You have to explain this. (You won't but it doesn't hurt to ask you to.) I understand your insults. They stem from your frustration. But answer this. How is it that someone who supports strong immigration control can't support universal health care? Your assertion, as usual, makes no sense at all.

[Daktoria]

Are you crazy? The only possible frustration would stem from self-fulfilling prophecy.

That's a serious question, not an insult, DrLee. If you don't understand freedom of assembly, then I'm not sure you should qualify as a person.

The same goes for ignoring abuse of process. It's nobody else's job to do your homework.

[Drlee]

I'm not crazy.

I have a good education.

I don't understand at all what you are talking about. Perhaps someone else can explain it to me.