[Rei Murasame]

No, I will not make concessions to Christian clergy on these issues. There is no argument that can convince me to allow them to have any say over these issues. Joey's scenario would cause me to explore my options with violent resistance no matter which way it is spun.

[Figlio di Moros]

We have a much bigger war to fight, Rei- if three strikes can be instituted eugenically, then ignore it and focus on the big bicture. Nobody wants to be the matyr that died for the right to kill babies, Rei. If anything, you'd be giving it legitimacy.

[Rei Murasame]

No, this is a deal-breaker, even if it happened under an allegedly fascist administration. If someone in a future implementation of fascism were to invite the Christian clergy or their associates to have the power to decide who shall or shall not have abortions, and those same clergy or their associates had the ability to control who does or does not go the slave camps, then we are no longer in a position where I can support the project.

I would hope that the guilds would rise up to purge that administration immediately, and if I were to find that they refuse to do that, then I would take the drastic step of joining the communists or leaving the country.

[Figlio di Moros]

So, you're making the assumption that any restriction or limitation on abortion is handing control over to clergy?

I'm sorry, Rei, but someone who believes women can't be trusted to educate their own children shouldn't make the assumption that women will strive for self-eugenic standards. We will need some standard in place to prevent the unfit from breeding, as well and encouraging the more fit to reproduce more. I'm not against sterilizing the homeless, but you seem to have an opposition to IUDing state-dependant mothers to prevent the underclass from being baby factories, or from preventing the upperclass from reducing their reproduction rate. How is this not dysgenic, Rei?

[Rei Murasame]

So, you're making the assumption that any restriction or limitation on abortion is handing control over to clergy?

I am not making that assumption, that is the scenario which Joey actually started this line of discussion with.

Basically there is no argument beyond that point. As soon as we cross into that territory, violence is the only answer. There is basically no argument that will cause me to support any limitation on the number of abortions that a woman can have, nor is there any argument that can convince me to allow the opposition to have panels that would determine this, and there is certainly no argument that can convince me that these people should have control over who will or will not be sent to slave camps.

[Figlio di Moros]

Well, I raised a different scenerio- one you ignored. Besides, Rei, sending women to slave camps has two benefits you might have ignored; the benefit of population control, and the benefit of a higher male-to-female ratio (correlates to conservative mentality and lower rates of rape).

[Rei Murasame]

Well, are you assuming that I'd want to cultivate a 'conservative' (read: gender-reactionary?) mentality? Also, how is making people work for free, a form of population control? To me that just sounds like an invitation for someone to smash wages by arresting people and making them work for free.

Especially in Joey's system, which would be a liberal-capitalist system, and thus would be a system capable of rationalising slave camps on a quasi-privatised profit-motivated basis.

[joeylyrics]

No, I will not make concessions to Christian clergy on these issues. There is no argument that can convince me to allow them to have any say over these issues. Joey's scenario would cause me to explore my options with violent resistance no matter which way it is spun.

Rei...

It has absolutely nothing to do with the Christian clergy.
What it does have to do with though is being concerned enough to even want to think of a logical yet fair enough solution which not only limits abortion rates while NOT banning abortions all together... but also giving woman some thought as well as some helpful insight regarding what their consequences as well as their options would be if they fail to become responsible enough to not keep hurting themselves or killing their unborn fetuses.
Loading an Ak 47 and killing people who are trying to help leads me to believe that you too need to be fitted for a straight jacket and locked up in a rubber room that keeps you far and away from civilization.
I am so sorry that being told or even being given some advice that's for your/our own good can turn you into such an irate young lady.
The more you rebel against logic though... the more you make yourself look like that monster you know deep down I know you are.

[Figlio di Moros]

I'm afraid attempting to place Rei in a nuthouse would bring a war you're not fit to fight, sir.

[youtube]ZyAuVZVhUEY[/youtube]

[joeylyrics]

I'm afraid attempting to place Rei in a nuthouse would bring a war you're not fit to fight, sir.

Figlio...

I'm more of a peaceful kind of guy.
I'd rather prevent a war than to have one.
Kind of explains why Rei and I don't get along.
Thanks for sharing that talented fight scene.
Now I see where she gets all of her hostility from.

[Rei Murasame]

that monster you know deep down I know you are.

Of course I'm a monster. I don't recall denying this.

[Figlio di Moros]

I think we've all established how difficult it is to put you down, Rei...

[Rei Murasame]

All jokes aside though, Joey is an example of how very extreme positions can be cast as 'normal', since he is able to consistently claim that his ideas are 'sensible peaceful compromises', even though they are completely batshit insane.

[Figlio di Moros]

Fair point- "peacefully compromise" on an extreme position and ship anyone who resists off the the mad house?

[joeylyrics]

All jokes aside though, Joey is an example of how very extreme positions can be cast as 'normal', since he is able to consistently claim that his ideas are 'sensible peaceful compromises', even though they are completely batshit insane.

Rei...


At least Joey can foresee upcoming dilemmas and tries to think of rational solutions that would benefit the people of this planet regardless of the world's ongoing over population problem as well as those who only think about themselves.
Quite frankly... if it wasn't for all of those greedy, back stabbing and "Live for the Moment" type of people who only live just to stay up all night every night thinking of new and improved ways to either get away with their disgusting habits OR to willingly nickel and dime the rest of us to death for their own gain INSTEAD of planning on avoiding future consequences and conflicts ... I probably wouldn't have found as many rules and/or laws that need to be obviously overturned.
Earth is the ONLY planet habitable to man regardless of what Nasa may try and convince you of.
That being said... planet Earth is what needs to be focused on as well as turning thoughtless people into more rational human beings.
Rebelling against what's right for one's own selfish gain is what's "Batshit Insane".
Those who refuse to agree with logic and reason are the one's that remain responsible for such chaos to continue season after sickening season.

[Elect G-Max]

What's all this bullshit about Christian clergy and violent resistance? The women who are having 3+ abortions don't need to be fitted with IUDs. They're handling population-control just fine on their own. It's the women who are having 6+ kids who need to get their tubes tied.

[youtube]ov_ZVC8q4mM[/youtube]

Regardless, even if we did implement a "3 strikes and you get an IUD or tubal ligation" rule, it would not be staffed by panels of christian clergy, and it would not be such a horrible situation that violent revolution would do more good than harm.

Planned Parenthood is a cheap and effective provider of birth control and sex education. Its policies are very useful for women who wish to avoid unplanned pregnancies, especially in low-income communities. And the GOP wants to shut them all down.

The GOP doesn't want to shut down PP. They only wish to cease public funding for a private organization. That's perfectly sensible.

science and common sense are both on the side of those who favour abortion.

No, sorry, they don't. They don't favor anyone in what is fundamentally a philosophical debate over the point at which a human embryo's right to live trumps the mother's right to purge a non-life-threatening parasite from her body.

You by far are the most clueless and careless person I have ever come across....

You must be related to the Antichrist.

Ad hominem arguments win every time.

[Figlio di Moros]

What's all this bullshit about Christian clergy and violent resistance? The women who are having 3+ abortions don't need to be fitted with IUDs. They're handling population-control just fine on their own. It's the women who are having 6+ kids who need to get their tubes tied.

Only the ones using them to live off the dole...

[Rei Murasame]

No, sorry, they don't. They don't favor anyone in what is fundamentally a philosophical debate over the point at which a human embryo's right to live trumps the mother's right to purge a non-life-threatening parasite from her body.

The 'right to live' does not exist.

[joeylyrics]

[quote="Elect G-Max"]What's all this bullshit about Christian clergy and violent resistance? The women who are having 3+ abortions don't need to be fitted with IUDs. They're handling population-control just fine on their own. It's the women who are having 6+ kids who need to get their tubes tied.


Regardless, even if we did implement a "3 strikes and you get an IUD or tubal ligation" rule, it would not be staffed by panels of christian clergy, and it would not be such a horrible situation that violent revolution would do more good than harm.



G-max...


The whole point of the three strike rule is to lower the number of abortions by guiding women/young ladies to become more responsible while limiting the harm to their bodies.
On the other hand...
Women who have a boat load of children with a shit load of different daddy's just so they can bank on government handouts should be jailed solely for bringing those children into the world for greed instead of love.
Most kids that are raised under these conditions either end up in prison or wind up in an urn over the fireplace.
That however is a totally different debate all together and is another important issue that shouldn't be overlooked.
The only way I am for pro life is if that life isn't going to be forced to be lonely, sad, hungry and mighty miserable.
That to me is just as unfair as someone forcing you to buy something you weren't quite ready to have and that you'll never quite be able to afford.
Three chances seems more than reasonable for such an uptight new world that expects you to not make any mistakes at all.

[Rei Murasame]

The whole point of the three strike rule is to lower the number of abortions by guiding women/young ladies to become more responsible while limiting the harm to their bodies.
On the other hand...
Women who have a boat load of children with a shit load of different daddy's just so they can bank on government handouts should be jailed solely for bringing those children into the world for greed instead of love.

So, let me get this straight:

• Woman has too many children: Jail.
  
  
• Woman aborts pregnancies to prevent children: Still Jail.

So basically no matter what we do, it's jail and slave labour camp.

I'm not even going to bother asking if your three strikes rule makes an exception in cases of rape or incest or health of the mother or foetus defect, since that question simply leads back to you setting up pregnancy-panels to determine who is or is not eligible for exception to your stupid rule, and who is or is not 'benefiting off the state'.

My answer is still this:


Don't think you could bring that sort of fucking treasonous liberal-capitalist blood-sucking octopus banker-owned government anywhere near me or my family or my community. We would find a way to destroy that government, and we would do it without remorse.