Underspoken Weapons of WWII - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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The Second World War (1939-1945).
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By Zagadka
#1251016
I'll just kick-start this with 2:

1) Germany 88
2) American Jeep

The 88 was a feared and devastatingly effective anti-air and anti-tank gun on all fronts. That's prety much it. Easy to produce and move, reliable, and powerful, it stayed active and effective throughout the war.

The Jeep, while a non-combat vehicle, allowed for rapid mobilization of infantry, enabling better communication and troop and small supply movement. It was far more robust and capable than its German counterparts, and the Soviets loved them and importated as many as they could. Along with the deuce-and-a-half, this allowed the Allied forces to use the principals of mechanized warfare that Germany pioneered back against them, with more rapid and efficient infantry deployment.

Oh, I'll add a third, though more noted - the bazooka, which gave unsupported infantry the ability to take out armored vehicles, and the effectiveness of which was so great that today, over 60 years later, advanced versions such as the RPG and shoulder-launched SAM and TOW are vital parts of any infantry unit, as well as giving light vehicles anti-armor capabilities.
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By Thunderhawk
#1251166
Soviet Burp gun

Soviet 76mm artillery, apparantly loved by the Germans.

German half track, a work horse.

Czech designed (and german operated) T-38, well designed, had wheels in addition to tracks providing superb movement on roads. The frame was later modified to take larger guns and became tank hunters.


the principals of mechanized warfare that Germany pioneered

Allies pioneered them in WW1 to exploit breaches in the lines by Artillery & tank actions.
Last edited by Thunderhawk on 28 Jun 2007 00:59, edited 1 time in total.
By Smilin' Dave
#1251212
The 88 was a feared and devastatingly effective anti-air and anti-tank gun on all fronts. That's prety much it. Easy to produce and move, reliable, and powerful, it stayed active and effective throughout the war.

I would actually argue that the 88 has received too much press. The reality was that reporting of attacks by the 88mm flak guns didn't match the actual number of the things available. Troops would often attribute losses to 88s which have in actual fact been caused by the PaK anti-tank guns. This mis-reporting even carries over to troops claim artillery were "88s".

Soviet Burp gun

Burp gun unless I am mistaken the nickname of an American sub-machinegun. The PPSh-41 was named Pepeshka (spelling?) by Soviet troops. No idea what the Germans called it.

Some more entries:
- The MG-42. The Germans were fielding a GPMG when the allies were still using water-cooled weapons of near-WWI vintage and LMGs with limited clip sizes. This gave the much ignored Germany infantry a critical edge. Subsequently copied post war and its ancestors are still in use apparently.
- The heavy mortar.
- The 'liberty ship'.
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By getfiscal
#1251229
I thought the German 88mm was very well known for being effective.

Also I'm pretty sure the jeep became popular.

Other underrated gear: Rifles, helmets, backpacks and canteens. If only they were given their due and more widely used by armies around the world! But alas they remain a relic of World War II.
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By Zagadka
#1251265
I'd like to add the various infantry landing craft, most famous for D-Day but even more important in the Pacific theater, where they were absolutely vital for the war effort.

Oh, and the field radio. Everything from mortar targeting to troop deployment depended heavily on it... first in tanks and later infantry. Though also developed further and used to this day.

I would actually argue that the 88 has received too much press.

Well, I've read a lot about German accounts of the gun, especially in the Afrika Korps. Given the under-supply of tanks Rommel had, it played an enhanced role there... its use in France is, I agree, not as vital.

Burp gun unless I am mistaken the nickname of an American sub-machinegun. The PPSh-41 was named Pepeshka (spelling?) by Soviet troops. No idea what the Germans called it.

heh, I've read old Soviet accounts of them coming straight out of the factory into the field in the battles around Moscow. That gun probably played a good part of the role of stopping the Germans.

Rifles

Hm. Well, until the M-16 came out, even the M-1 was used up through Viet Nam, especially the carbine version used by support personnel.

helmets

Meh. Used since WWI and improved upon constantly and used to this day.

canteens

Also used to this day... though the modern version is usually a backpack-mounted "camel" canteen with a tube which it is used through. It is one of the consumer products the Army started using in its modernization in the '90s, used by backpackers and in various sports such as off road racing since the '80s.
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By Praetor
#1251745
The speed and range of the Douglas DC-3 revolutionized air transport, and its contributions to the war effort are often unappreciated.
By Smilin' Dave
#1253676
I thought the German 88mm was very well known for being effective.

It was, indeed it was later adapted into a dedicated anti-tank gun. But it is never the less overhyped.

Well, I've read a lot about German accounts of the gun, especially in the Afrika Korps. Given the under-supply of tanks Rommel had, it played an enhanced role there

Rommel himself gives credit to the 88, but he also noted the importance of integrating the humble anti-tank gun into his mobile units (something the British had trouble getting their head around). Keep in the mind that the 88 wasn't very mobile, and hence was more likely to go into action when the DAK were on the 'back foot'.

I'd like to add the various infantry landing craft, most famous for D-Day but even more important in the Pacific theater, where they were absolutely vital for the war effort.

A good point. The amphibious tractor concept used in the Pacific were (unless I am mistaken) created in WWII, and are still in use by the Marines today.

Another addition (although debatable if it's really a WWII thing): The molotov cocktail.
By Torwan
#1255619
German fighter FW 190

Introduced in 1941, it was supposed to replace the aging Me 109 that reached its peak in 1941 with the F-variant (later variants were faster, but lacked range and maneuverability).

The FW 190 was initiatially faster and more maneuverable than its british counterparts (Spitfire V). It was still new and had a lot of development potential.

However, the course of the war didn't allow the FW 190 to show its true capacity. The Me 109 had to be produced further, so the FW 190 didn't get the necessary press and publicity.

The FW 190 was used as a daylight-fighter, nightfighter (Operation "Wilde Sau"), high-speed high-altitude fighter (FW 190 D), fighter/bomber with rockets and photocell-triggered guns (FW 190 F) and a super-fast super-high fighter (Ta 152) which outflew all allied fighters (the reason why it was taken during "Operation Paperclip" after the war).

The FW 190 did very well, but it never received the same attention as the Me 109 or the Me 262.
By GandalfTheGrey
#1258383
I heard (once) about a particular monster artillery gun the Germans used in the siege of Sevastapool. I'm not 100% but I think it was the biggest gun used in the war? I've often wondered about that - anyone got any information?
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By Thunderhawk
#1258398
Probably one of their many railroad guns.
Large LARGE artillery pieces built with rail tracks into the base.

I believe their biggest gun needed to rest on 2 sets of tracks side by side.
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By Truth-a-naut
#1258503
Gandalf, you're thinking of the "Thor" siege mortar. A massive impractical 600mm mortar.

But as for all the other items in most cricles they're given credit where it's due. Maybe you're just talking to the wrong people?

I'll throw in the SVT-40 and the Garand. They revolutionized infantry... It was surprising how long it took the Germans to adopt an auto loading rifle, and when they did it wasn't very good (G41 and K43).
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By Thunderhawk
#1258535
The SVT-40 strikes me as a test piece that resulted in new designs after the war. During the war, it seems to have been mediocre to par, and doesnt deserve special praise as a WW2 weapon.


Back to underspoken weapons, Ill throw in the Il-2 (by Ilyushin). For the Soviet side it is not underspoken at all, but it is largely ignored by the West, or mocked for its lack of armour for the rear gunner. Dispite that rather massive flaw, it was still a superb plane which helped the Soviet infantry greatly.
Last edited by Thunderhawk on 05 Jul 2007 08:40, edited 1 time in total.
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By Nattering Nabob
#1258536
The "proximity fuse", basically a VHF radio RADAR inside an anti-aircraft shell that increased aircraft hits seven fold...
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By soron
#1262059
Soviet 76mm artillery, apparantly loved by the Germans.


...and for a reason, the "Ratsch-Bumm" (indicating that the fireing and impact of the shell happened almost simultaneously) was a 7.62 cm (3") cannon. The Russians used them as artillery, anti-tank and anti-aircraft gun, and iirc this gun was also used in the T-34 tank. It was easy to handle, it shot quiet well, and it had a surprising similarity with the German guns. It should. The gun was designed and produced by the German company Rheinmetall-Borsig for the Russians, prior the war.
One of the little ironies in that war that we supplied the Russians with some of the most effective weapons to use against us, and even without introducing it into our own army. :roll:
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By Thunderhawk
#1262132
The gun was designed and produced by the German company Rheinmetall-Borsig for the Russians, prior the war.

The Soviets were always good at reproducing something someone else gave them.

[/quote]
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By Truth-a-naut
#1262360
@Gandalf/Truth-a-naut:


Thor was used during the siege of Sevastapool as well. I wasn't aware that a rail gun was involved too, you learn something new everyday.
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By alyster
#1262461
The Soviets were always good at reproducing something someone else gave them.


Yes and not only given but taken during WW2. In ex Soviet Union well known brands as Moskvitch started off this way. Moskvitch 400/420, the first model, was a knock-off from Opel Kadett. After reaching Germany the hand watches in USSR also turned quite abit smaller cause Red Army had captured some good factory equipment. Civil goods and quality hadn't been a priority before that.

Even smallest things can be traced back to Germany and ww2.
This is from Germany 1942.......................................................This from Soviet Union 1980s
Image Image



I think we still have one or 2 of these at home somewhere.

But it wasn't only soviets doing it, but westerners aswell.
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By Oxymoron
#1307416
I would say the most effective weapon was winter it stopped the Germans at the gates of Moscow.

But actual weapons what about A-bomb stopped war with Japan saved millions of lifes.

tactical weapon I would have to say T-34, Katuysha, and sturmavick as the soviets best weapons.

Germans: Stucca Bomber, Mark IV tank, Panther

Americans: Sherman Tank, B-17, Mustang

Italians: Expresso, Leather belts, and Funny looking Dictator
By Rick
#1307624
Glad for the recognition of the Jeep, product of my former hometown, Toldeo, Ohio. I also saw a copy of the world's first SUV at the Imperial War Museum in London. Incidentally, the museum is housed in what used to be "Bedlam", ie, the Bethlehem Lunatic Asylum. :)

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